Comments on: Many Ways to Integrate HTML into PHP http://gulati.info/2010/01/many-ways-to-integrate-html-into-php/ Just another WordPress weblog Mon, 19 Jul 2010 23:15:32 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Austin http://gulati.info/2010/01/many-ways-to-integrate-html-into-php/comment-page-1/#comment-697 Austin Thu, 28 Jan 2010 10:05:11 +0000 http://gulati.info/?p=1737#comment-697 @Nitin I'm glad to hear that I'm not wrong in suggesting not to use '<?='! Thanks for your comment! @Intrepidity The code in your comment was removed by WordPress, so I'm not sure what you're saying. Thanks for the comment though! @Konstantin Thanks for the comment. I agree with you! MVC still requires PHP to be inserted into HTML. And it's wrong to assume that anyone who doesn't use it is a 'complete knob'. There are many times when MVC isn't the right solution. @Rob Nitin (above) said that he has used a server that has it disabled. I've never worked with a server that had it disabled but I still think that it's safer to keep it out, especially if you are distributing code. Thanks for your comment! @Iain Thanks for your comment! I definitely agree with you on the MVC issue. @Isabelle That's definitely a method that works. I tend to stay away from doing things like that for smaller projects since it seems like overkill. I've done it with larger projects, though. Thanks for your comment! @Nitin

I’m glad to hear that I’m not wrong in suggesting not to use ‘<?=’! Thanks for your comment!

@Intrepidity

The code in your comment was removed by WordPress, so I’m not sure what you’re saying. Thanks for the comment though!

@Konstantin

Thanks for the comment. I agree with you! MVC still requires PHP to be inserted into HTML. And it’s wrong to assume that anyone who doesn’t use it is a ‘complete knob’. There are many times when MVC isn’t the right solution.

@Rob

Nitin (above) said that he has used a server that has it disabled. I’ve never worked with a server that had it disabled but I still think that it’s safer to keep it out, especially if you are distributing code. Thanks for your comment!

@Iain

Thanks for your comment! I definitely agree with you on the MVC issue.

@Isabelle

That’s definitely a method that works. I tend to stay away from doing things like that for smaller projects since it seems like overkill. I’ve done it with larger projects, though. Thanks for your comment!

]]> By: Isabelle http://gulati.info/2010/01/many-ways-to-integrate-html-into-php/comment-page-1/#comment-645 Isabelle Tue, 19 Jan 2010 23:30:13 +0000 http://gulati.info/?p=1737#comment-645 I wrote myself a HTML engine. I put every HTML tag into a PHP class and gave them the ability to render as html. Currently i am writing a site kit to simplify the site coding. Sepparation of back end and front end is defined by your discipline of sticking to MVC, not by sepparating HTML and PHP. I wrote myself a HTML engine.
I put every HTML tag into a PHP class and gave them the ability to render as html.
Currently i am writing a site kit to simplify the site coding.
Sepparation of back end and front end is defined by your discipline of sticking to MVC, not by sepparating HTML and PHP.

]]> By: Iain http://gulati.info/2010/01/many-ways-to-integrate-html-into-php/comment-page-1/#comment-640 Iain Mon, 18 Jan 2010 14:21:30 +0000 http://gulati.info/?p=1737#comment-640 Agree with everyone who ripped Greg a new one. Real-world and ideal-world are different places, and when he's had some real-world experience with large sites and large clients, he'll realise this. Good article Austin - helpful for the new folk, for sure. Agree with everyone who ripped Greg a new one. Real-world and ideal-world are different places, and when he’s had some real-world experience with large sites and large clients, he’ll realise this.

Good article Austin – helpful for the new folk, for sure.

]]> By: esaj http://gulati.info/2010/01/many-ways-to-integrate-html-into-php/comment-page-1/#comment-639 esaj Mon, 18 Jan 2010 11:31:30 +0000 http://gulati.info/?p=1737#comment-639 @Greg - If by "knobs" you mean those of us with the real-world experience to not be mindless followers, then you would not realize that MVC is child's toy, unlike the more nuanced enterprise architectures. Perhaps, once you've coded for a few years, you'll realize that there are occasions that call for over-engineered frameworks, and situations where you have 30 minutes to create a solution before total annihilation. @Greg – If by “knobs” you mean those of us with the real-world experience to not be mindless followers, then you would not realize that MVC is child’s toy, unlike the more nuanced enterprise architectures. Perhaps, once you’ve coded for a few years, you’ll realize that there are occasions that call for over-engineered frameworks, and situations where you have 30 minutes to create a solution before total annihilation.

]]> By: Rob http://gulati.info/2010/01/many-ways-to-integrate-html-into-php/comment-page-1/#comment-637 Rob Mon, 18 Jan 2010 09:55:19 +0000 http://gulati.info/?p=1737#comment-637 The <?= I thought was called the evaluation tag? Oddly I have been PHP-ing since 2000 and never came across a server that didn't have the evaluation tag turned on. I have seen many thank god that have the ASP % tags off. Either way. In regards to the MVC fanboy comment, is it really necessary to use a full blown MVC framework if all you are doing is taking data from a form and sticking it into database? Isn't like rule #1 of being a good programmer is to re use code? You're saying that you have to use and MVC Framework to do basic CRUD cause you don't have your own code to re-use. The <?= I thought was called the evaluation tag? Oddly I have been PHP-ing since 2000 and never came across a server that didn’t have the evaluation tag turned on. I have seen many thank god that have the ASP % tags off.

Either way. In regards to the MVC fanboy comment, is it really necessary to use a full blown MVC framework if all you are doing is taking data from a form and sticking it into database? Isn’t like rule #1 of being a good programmer is to re use code? You’re saying that you have to use and MVC Framework to do basic CRUD cause you don’t have your own code to re-use.

]]> By: Konstantin http://gulati.info/2010/01/many-ways-to-integrate-html-into-php/comment-page-1/#comment-636 Konstantin Mon, 18 Jan 2010 06:14:23 +0000 http://gulati.info/?p=1737#comment-636 Greg, MVC? Really? So you must be not the "complete knob" for that matter ;) Well, as far as I know MVC does divide your logics and page layout, but how "not knob" is it to say that MVC cuts out php tags in your view? Who ever said that? Nobody knows exactly what MVC is, that's what the dev guys at Google said last year @ Google Developer Day, thus introducing the MVP (Model-View-Presenter) model ;) But still, MVC, MVP, whatever. If I wanna put a damn title between my title tags in the head section of my html layout, how the hell am I supposed to do that without the php tags? Lemme guess - string replacement with a search for [my-title-goes-here] in the model? ;) Omg, are we back to Smarty? Austin, Good post. ;) Cheers, ~ K. Greg, MVC? Really? So you must be not the “complete knob” for that matter ;) Well, as far as I know MVC does divide your logics and page layout, but how “not knob” is it to say that MVC cuts out php tags in your view?

Who ever said that? Nobody knows exactly what MVC is, that’s what the dev guys at Google said last year @ Google Developer Day, thus introducing the MVP (Model-View-Presenter) model ;)

But still, MVC, MVP, whatever. If I wanna put a damn title between my title tags in the head section of my html layout, how the hell am I supposed to do that without the php tags? Lemme guess – string replacement with a search for [my-title-goes-here] in the model? ;) Omg, are we back to Smarty?

Austin, Good post. ;)

Cheers,
~ K.

]]> By: Intrepidity http://gulati.info/2010/01/many-ways-to-integrate-html-into-php/comment-page-1/#comment-635 Intrepidity Mon, 18 Jan 2010 05:31:26 +0000 http://gulati.info/?p=1737#comment-635 I use a template parser. But in the unlikely case that i should need to use pure PHP in a template i would use I use a template parser. But in the unlikely case that i should need to use pure PHP in a template i would use

]]> By: Nitin Reddy Katkam http://gulati.info/2010/01/many-ways-to-integrate-html-into-php/comment-page-1/#comment-634 Nitin Reddy Katkam Mon, 18 Jan 2010 02:34:18 +0000 http://gulati.info/?p=1737#comment-634 I use a combination of the "Jump out of PHP" method and heredoc/nowdoc. I've experienced the "<?=" issue on a server with short_open_tag disabled (I believe it was on a recent version of XAMPP running on a Windows box) and ever since have been using echo instead to simplify deployment. I use a combination of the “Jump out of PHP” method and heredoc/nowdoc.

I’ve experienced the “<?=" issue on a server with short_open_tag disabled (I believe it was on a recent version of XAMPP running on a Windows box) and ever since have been using echo instead to simplify deployment.

]]> By: Austin http://gulati.info/2010/01/many-ways-to-integrate-html-into-php/comment-page-1/#comment-633 Austin Mon, 18 Jan 2010 02:02:05 +0000 http://gulati.info/?p=1737#comment-633 @Greg - Well, I wouldn't say that everyone who doesn't use MVC is a complete knob. Thanks for the comment though! @Trey - I decided to leave out heredoc syntax. Personally, I don't like it at all. I probably should include it for completeness, though. Thanks for the comment! @sebounet - WordPress took out all of your code, so I'm not sure what you're saying. @Rob - Yeah, sorry that WordPress spliced your comments so bad. Using <?= only works if short_open_tag is set to 1: <a href="http://php.net/manual/en/ini.core.php" rel="nofollow">link</a> (it's the first item on the page). So it's safer to just use <?php echo unless you are sure that it will be enabled. Thanks for the comment! @Greg – Well, I wouldn’t say that everyone who doesn’t use MVC is a complete knob. Thanks for the comment though!

@Trey – I decided to leave out heredoc syntax. Personally, I don’t like it at all. I probably should include it for completeness, though. Thanks for the comment!

@sebounet – WordPress took out all of your code, so I’m not sure what you’re saying.

@Rob – Yeah, sorry that WordPress spliced your comments so bad. Using <?= only works if short_open_tag is set to 1: link (it’s the first item on the page). So it’s safer to just use <?php echo unless you are sure that it will be enabled. Thanks for the comment!

]]> By: Rob http://gulati.info/2010/01/many-ways-to-integrate-html-into-php/comment-page-1/#comment-632 Rob Sun, 17 Jan 2010 19:32:15 +0000 http://gulati.info/?p=1737#comment-632 Yes I use <?= $var ?> alot but I never see other people doing it. Is it wrong? <title><?= $pageTitle ?></title> Seem pretty logical to me. However to make things easier at work, we put all of our websites into a content system. Everything that is programming has to produce standard HTML UL/LI and DIVs and all things need to have a class name or similar. Then programming is wrapped into a tag, ex: {navigation}. Designer then has to style with CSS the output. My company used to work design first then developer. Everytime it went wrong. Develop first designer later works better and faster. Yes I use <?= $var ?> alot but I never see other people doing it. Is it wrong?

<title><?= $pageTitle ?></title>

Seem pretty logical to me.

However to make things easier at work, we put all of our websites into a content system. Everything that is programming has to produce standard HTML UL/LI and DIVs and all things need to have a class name or similar. Then programming is wrapped into a tag, ex: {navigation}.

Designer then has to style with CSS the output. My company used to work design first then developer. Everytime it went wrong. Develop first designer later works better and faster.

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